DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?

tim malamphy

DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?
Has anyone gone production on version 7 WITHOUT
licensing the IBM utils? If so, are you using CA or
BMC?

While there was considerable input to the list from
BMC and Platinum that they could fully replace the IBM
utils for V7, there has been little traffic as of
late. Has it been smooth sailing for everyone?
Looking at our list of open problems with our utility
provider that must be fixed before we can upgrade
makes me wonder.

tim
--- Ed Long <[login to unmask email]> wrote:
> Pet Peeve alert, even the IBM utilities in V 7.1
> have
> limited LOB support.
> I'm not sure that is yet a differentiator between
> IBM
> and the others.
> --- "Pearson, Eric L," <[login to unmask email]>
> wrote:
> > Ditto here.
> > All our prod DBA jobs now use IBM utilities.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Eric Pearson
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Jeremiah Eden
> > [mailto:[login to unmask email]
> > Sent: Thursday, January 02, 2003 1:42 PM
> > To: [login to unmask email]
> > Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade
> >
> >
> > We ran with and without the V7 utilities. The DBA
> > vote was for the
> > Utilities. Since then the DBAs have found out that
> > the new V7 Utility
> > features replace most of the functionality in the
> > OEM utilities which we
> > had.
> >
> > ** The opinions expressed in this Email are
> those
> > of my own **
> > ** and do not reflect those of my employer or
> > Spiritual Advisor **
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Christina S. Maldonado
> > [mailto:[login to unmask email]
> > Sent: Thursday, January 02, 2003 11:51 AM
> > To: [login to unmask email]
> > Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade
> >
> >
> > My exact question also. If anyone out
> there
> > has implemented DB2 V7,
> > did you all also purchase the IBM DB2 Utilities
> > Suite? Can an ISV
> > product suffice the requirements without the
> > utilities suite such at
> > Platinum or BMC?
> > We have already completed migration to DB2 V7 with
> > one of Test subsystems
> > and has been good so far.
> > Testing is in progress by the DBA's
> >
> >
> > Christina Maldonado
> > AdvancePCS.
> >
> > ----- Forwarded by Christina Maldonado/PCSHS on
> > 01/02/2003 10:45 AM -----
> >
> > "Ohling, Tim R -
> > CNF"
> To:
> > [login to unmask email]
> > <[login to unmask email]
> cc:
> > OM>
> > Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7
> > upgrade
> > Sent by: DB2 Data
> > Base Discussion
> > List
> > <[login to unmask email]
> > LASSOC.COM>
> >
> >
> > 01/02/2003 09:36
> > AM
> > Please respond to
> > DB2 Data Base
> > Discussion List
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Are you going to get the IBM Utilities suites in
> > addition to CA/Platinum?
> >
> > Test very carefully. P99D does not support many
> of
> > the V7 features
> > (real-time stats, updating all stats columns in
> the
> > catalog with PDASTATS,
> > image copy or reorg of LOBs, etc.).
> >
> > If you're using any of the V7 features install by
> > APAR in V6, you'll
> > probably want to wait for the P01D release of the
> > Platinum utilities and
> > tools. It still won't have full LOB support.
> >
> > HTH,
> > Tim
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Whittaker, Stephen
> > [mailto:[login to unmask email]
> > Sent: Thursday, January 02, 2003 7:28 AM
> > To: [login to unmask email]
> > Subject: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade
> >
> >
> >
> > We are in the planning stages of going from
> > DB2 v6 OS/390 to DB2 v7
> > OS/390.
> > Here is our current set up.
> >
> >
> > Running DB2 v6 at maint. level 0105 on
> OS/390
> > which is at v2.6
> > Vendor Tools: CA/Platinum P99F series.
> > IBM product: Heavily using DB2 Connect
> > Enterprise Edition v7.2 @
> > Fixpack 5 & Run Time Client v7.2 FP5.
> >
> >
> > If anyone has already upgraded to DB2 v7
> > OS/390 and has a similar
> > environment I would appreciate hearing
> > any success or horror stories you may have
> > encountered. Hints/tips
> > would be helpful.
> > Please feel free to contact me off-line
> from
> > this discussion group.
> >
> >
> > Thank-you:
> > --Steve....
> >
> >
> > Steve Whittaker
> >
> >
> > To change your subscription options or to cancel
> > your subscription visit the
> > DB2-L webpage at http://listserv.ylassoc.com. The
> > owners of the list can be
> >
> >
> >
> > To change your subscription options or to cancel
> > your subscription visit the
> > DB2-L webpage at http://listserv.ylassoc.com. The
> > owners of the list can be
> >
> >
> >
> > To change your subscription options or to cancel
> > your subscription visit the DB2-L webpage at
> > http://listserv.ylassoc.com. The owners of the
> list
> > can be reached at
> [login to unmask email]
>
>
> =====
> Edward Long
>
>
> To change your subscription options or to cancel
> your subscription visit the DB2-L webpage at
> http://listserv.ylassoc.com. The owners of the list
> can be reached at
[login to unmask email]


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Isaac Yassin

Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?
(in response to tim malamphy)
Hi,

Last IDUG (at Lisbon) I talked with both BMC & CA people about it.

BMC people said you must have IBM's utilities if you want to use BMC
utilities. CA people said you can use only theirs and you don't need
IBM's utilities to run CA utilities.

I don't have it in writing, it was only during conversations.

Isaac Yassin
DBMS & IT Consultant
IBM Certified Solution Expert
DB2 V7.1 Database Administration for OS/390



-----Original Message-----
From: DB2 Data Base Discussion List [mailto:[login to unmask email]
On Behalf Of tim malamphy
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 2:14 AM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?


Has anyone gone production on version 7 WITHOUT
licensing the IBM utils? If so, are you using CA or
BMC?

While there was considerable input to the list from
BMC and Platinum that they could fully replace the IBM
utils for V7, there has been little traffic as of
late. Has it been smooth sailing for everyone?
Looking at our list of open problems with our utility
provider that must be fixed before we can upgrade
makes me wonder.

tim
-



Tina Hilton

Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?
(in response to Isaac Yassin)
I believe there is one IBM utility that no other vendor can fully replace,
and that's modify recovery. As I recall, they can delete the records from
syscopy but not from syslgrnx, and the DBD doesn't get cleaned up. So if
you're willing to let your syslgrnx get bigger and bigger and bigger, then
maybe you can skip the IBM utilities if you already have the CA ones. I
think BMC C+/Modify would fail the first time it tried to call IBM's modify
recovery to do the syslgrnx/DBD cleanup.

We plan to upgrade to V7 this year, with only the utility package that
include modify recovery. We have BMC products and want to retain the
ability to do normal modify recovers.

Tina

-----Original Message-----
From: Isaac Yassin [mailto:[login to unmask email]
Sent: January 03, 2003 6:02 AM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?


Hi,

Last IDUG (at Lisbon) I talked with both BMC & CA people about it.

BMC people said you must have IBM's utilities if you want to use BMC
utilities. CA people said you can use only theirs and you don't need
IBM's utilities to run CA utilities.

I don't have it in writing, it was only during conversations.

Isaac Yassin
DBMS & IT Consultant
IBM Certified Solution Expert
DB2 V7.1 Database Administration for OS/390



-----Original Message-----
From: DB2 Data Base Discussion List [mailto:[login to unmask email]
On Behalf Of tim malamphy
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 2:14 AM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?


Has anyone gone production on version 7 WITHOUT
licensing the IBM utils? If so, are you using CA or
BMC?

While there was considerable input to the list from
BMC and Platinum that they could fully replace the IBM
utils for V7, there has been little traffic as of
late. Has it been smooth sailing for everyone?
Looking at our list of open problems with our utility
provider that must be fixed before we can upgrade
makes me wonder.

tim
-








Christina S. Maldonado

Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?
(in response to Tina Hilton)
In order to use any the Modify Recovery you must purchase the entire
Packaged IBM DB2 Utilities suite, which consist of the DB2 Operational
Utilities and recovery diagnostics utilities. Just as an FYI, during the
BUILD2 phase of a reorg, the NPIs are locked out for SQL processing.



Thanks Christina.
480-391-4802





Tina Hilton
<[login to unmask email] To: [login to unmask email]
YSTEMS.COM> cc:
Sent by: DB2 Data Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using
Base Discussion List IBM utils?
<[login to unmask email]
SOC.COM>


01/03/2003 05:38 AM
Please respond to
DB2 Data Base
Discussion List






I believe there is one IBM utility that no other vendor can fully replace,
and that's modify recovery. As I recall, they can delete the records from
syscopy but not from syslgrnx, and the DBD doesn't get cleaned up. So if
you're willing to let your syslgrnx get bigger and bigger and bigger, then
maybe you can skip the IBM utilities if you already have the CA ones. I
think BMC C+/Modify would fail the first time it tried to call IBM's modify
recovery to do the syslgrnx/DBD cleanup.

We plan to upgrade to V7 this year, with only the utility package that
include modify recovery. We have BMC products and want to retain the
ability to do normal modify recovers.

Tina

-----Original Message-----
From: Isaac Yassin [mailto:[login to unmask email]
Sent: January 03, 2003 6:02 AM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?


Hi,

Last IDUG (at Lisbon) I talked with both BMC & CA people about it.

BMC people said you must have IBM's utilities if you want to use BMC
utilities. CA people said you can use only theirs and you don't need
IBM's utilities to run CA utilities.

I don't have it in writing, it was only during conversations.

Isaac Yassin
DBMS & IT Consultant
IBM Certified Solution Expert
DB2 V7.1 Database Administration for OS/390



-----Original Message-----
From: DB2 Data Base Discussion List [mailto:[login to unmask email]
On Behalf Of tim malamphy
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 2:14 AM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?


Has anyone gone production on version 7 WITHOUT
licensing the IBM utils? If so, are you using CA or
BMC?

While there was considerable input to the list from
BMC and Platinum that they could fully replace the IBM
utils for V7, there has been little traffic as of
late. Has it been smooth sailing for everyone?
Looking at our list of open problems with our utility
provider that must be fixed before we can upgrade
makes me wonder.

tim
-



the





the DB2-L webpage at http://listserv.ylassoc.com. The owners of the list
can



Roger Miller

Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade
(in response to Christina S. Maldonado)
Your first step needs to be migrating to a current release of OS/390 (only
V2R10 makes sense now) or z/OS. DB2 V7 uses a number of services, such as
Unicode, that are not in V2R6. I presume you know that OS/390 V2R6 is more
than four years old and out of service. I hope you have already ordered
OS/390 V2R10, since that provides a relatively easy upgrade and then allows
you to jump to z/OS R4 in 2003 or 2004.

I put a number of hints and tips into a presentation (pdf) on
http://www.ibm.com/software/data/db2/os390/presentations.html

or directly to
ftp://ftp.software.ibm.com/software/db2storedprocedure/db2zos390/techdocs/mi
gratev7.pdf

Roger Miller

On Thu, 2 Jan 2003 10:28:09 -0500, Whittaker, Stephen
<[login to unmask email]> wrote:

> We are in the planning stages of going from DB2 v6 OS/390 to DB2 v7
OS/390.
>Here is our current set up.
>
>Running DB2 v6 at maint. level 0105 on OS/390 which is at v2.6
>Vendor Tools: CA/Platinum P99F series.
>IBM product: Heavily using DB2 Connect Enterprise Edition v7.2 @ Fixpack 5
&
>Run Time Client v7.2 FP5.
>
>If anyone has already upgraded to DB2 v7 OS/390 and has a similar
>environment I would appreciate hearing
>any success or horror stories you may have encountered. Hints/tips would be
>helpful.
> Please feel free to contact me off-line from this discussion group.
>
>Thank-you:
>--Steve....
>
>Steve Whittaker



Steve Whittaker

Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade
(in response to Roger Miller)
Roger:
Thanks for the info, and 'yes' we are starting to move to os/390 v2.10 at
this
time. At least I see it on the software upgrade schedule.
So now its just a matter of planning out our strategy of going from Db2 v6
to Db2 v7.
There has been some discussion and suggestions that we should get more
current with
our maintenance on v6 before we move on to v7.
BUT here's a little clip from a comment from IBM that we received about
that:

>>urban myth all the way!!! Info APAR II12653 documents all the
fallback/toleration fixes you need and thats that. You put those PTFs on and
just like every migration you have done in the past, it will work. Glad you
were not fooled/tricked into a lot more work than needed by an unofficial
source. Glad you are smarter than that and just go with II12653. <<

Seems there is a difference of opinion as to how to get to v7 from v6.
Anyways, all this info I'm getting back is going to be a big help, thats for
sure.

Thanks again:
--Steve....

-----Original Message-----
From: Roger Miller [mailto:[login to unmask email]
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 12:40 PM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade


Your first step needs to be migrating to a current release of OS/390 (only
V2R10 makes sense now) or z/OS. DB2 V7 uses a number of services, such as
Unicode, that are not in V2R6. I presume you know that OS/390 V2R6 is more
than four years old and out of service. I hope you have already ordered
OS/390 V2R10, since that provides a relatively easy upgrade and then allows
you to jump to z/OS R4 in 2003 or 2004.

I put a number of hints and tips into a presentation (pdf) on
http://www.ibm.com/software/data/db2/os390/presentations.html

or directly to
ftp://ftp.software.ibm.com/software/db2storedprocedure/db2zos390/techdocs/mi
gratev7.pdf

Roger Miller

>
>Steve Whittaker





Tina Hilton

Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?
(in response to Steve Whittaker)
You can just buy the diagnostic and recovery utilities (feature 5655-e62).
You don't need the whole shebang. At least that's what I've read. See page
211 in http://www.redbooks.ibm.com/pubs/pdfs/redbooks/sg246121.pdf.

Tina

-----Original Message-----
From: Christina S. Maldonado [mailto:[login to unmask email]
Sent: January 03, 2003 11:42 AM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?


In order to use any the Modify Recovery you must purchase the entire
Packaged IBM DB2 Utilities suite, which consist of the DB2 Operational
Utilities and recovery diagnostics utilities. Just as an FYI, during the
BUILD2 phase of a reorg, the NPIs are locked out for SQL processing.



Thanks Christina.
480-391-4802





Tina Hilton
<[login to unmask email] To:
[login to unmask email]
YSTEMS.COM> cc:
Sent by: DB2 Data Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390
v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using
Base Discussion List IBM utils?
<[login to unmask email]
SOC.COM>


01/03/2003 05:38 AM
Please respond to
DB2 Data Base
Discussion List






I believe there is one IBM utility that no other vendor can fully replace,
and that's modify recovery. As I recall, they can delete the records from
syscopy but not from syslgrnx, and the DBD doesn't get cleaned up. So if
you're willing to let your syslgrnx get bigger and bigger and bigger, then
maybe you can skip the IBM utilities if you already have the CA ones. I
think BMC C+/Modify would fail the first time it tried to call IBM's modify
recovery to do the syslgrnx/DBD cleanup.

We plan to upgrade to V7 this year, with only the utility package that
include modify recovery. We have BMC products and want to retain the
ability to do normal modify recovers.

Tina

-----Original Message-----
From: Isaac Yassin [mailto:[login to unmask email]
Sent: January 03, 2003 6:02 AM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?


Hi,

Last IDUG (at Lisbon) I talked with both BMC & CA people about it.

BMC people said you must have IBM's utilities if you want to use BMC
utilities. CA people said you can use only theirs and you don't need
IBM's utilities to run CA utilities.

I don't have it in writing, it was only during conversations.

Isaac Yassin
DBMS & IT Consultant
IBM Certified Solution Expert
DB2 V7.1 Database Administration for OS/390



-----Original Message-----
From: DB2 Data Base Discussion List [mailto:[login to unmask email]
On Behalf Of tim malamphy
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 2:14 AM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?


Has anyone gone production on version 7 WITHOUT
licensing the IBM utils? If so, are you using CA or
BMC?

While there was considerable input to the list from
BMC and Platinum that they could fully replace the IBM
utils for V7, there has been little traffic as of
late. Has it been smooth sailing for everyone?
Looking at our list of open problems with our utility
provider that must be fixed before we can upgrade
makes me wonder.

tim
-



the





the DB2-L webpage at http://listserv.ylassoc.com. The owners of the list
can








Christina S. Maldonado

Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?
(in response to Tina Hilton)
That is what it looks like also in the announcement letter, but when I
called IBM to ask, they indicated you must purchase the suite in order to
get the recovery utilities. Maybe it has changed. If you hear
different from IBM, let me know, so that I may inquire again.


Thanks Christina.
480-391-4802





Tina Hilton
<[login to unmask email] To: [login to unmask email]
YSTEMS.COM> cc:
Sent by: DB2 Data Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using
Base Discussion List IBM utils?
<[login to unmask email]
SOC.COM>


01/03/2003 11:29 AM
Please respond to
DB2 Data Base
Discussion List






You can just buy the diagnostic and recovery utilities (feature 5655-e62).
You don't need the whole shebang. At least that's what I've read. See
page
211 in http://www.redbooks.ibm.com/pubs/pdfs/redbooks/sg246121.pdf.

Tina

-----Original Message-----
From: Christina S. Maldonado [mailto:[login to unmask email]
Sent: January 03, 2003 11:42 AM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?


In order to use any the Modify Recovery you must purchase the entire
Packaged IBM DB2 Utilities suite, which consist of the DB2 Operational
Utilities and recovery diagnostics utilities. Just as an FYI, during the
BUILD2 phase of a reorg, the NPIs are locked out for SQL processing.



Thanks Christina.
480-391-4802





Tina Hilton
<[login to unmask email] To:
[login to unmask email]
YSTEMS.COM> cc:
Sent by: DB2 Data Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390
v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using
Base Discussion List IBM utils?
<[login to unmask email]
SOC.COM>


01/03/2003 05:38 AM
Please respond to
DB2 Data Base
Discussion List






I believe there is one IBM utility that no other vendor can fully replace,
and that's modify recovery. As I recall, they can delete the records from
syscopy but not from syslgrnx, and the DBD doesn't get cleaned up. So if
you're willing to let your syslgrnx get bigger and bigger and bigger, then
maybe you can skip the IBM utilities if you already have the CA ones. I
think BMC C+/Modify would fail the first time it tried to call IBM's modify
recovery to do the syslgrnx/DBD cleanup.

We plan to upgrade to V7 this year, with only the utility package that
include modify recovery. We have BMC products and want to retain the
ability to do normal modify recovers.

Tina

-----Original Message-----
From: Isaac Yassin [mailto:[login to unmask email]
Sent: January 03, 2003 6:02 AM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?


Hi,

Last IDUG (at Lisbon) I talked with both BMC & CA people about it.

BMC people said you must have IBM's utilities if you want to use BMC
utilities. CA people said you can use only theirs and you don't need
IBM's utilities to run CA utilities.

I don't have it in writing, it was only during conversations.

Isaac Yassin
DBMS & IT Consultant
IBM Certified Solution Expert
DB2 V7.1 Database Administration for OS/390



-----Original Message-----
From: DB2 Data Base Discussion List [mailto:[login to unmask email]
On Behalf Of tim malamphy
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 2:14 AM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?


Has anyone gone production on version 7 WITHOUT
licensing the IBM utils? If so, are you using CA or
BMC?

While there was considerable input to the list from
BMC and Platinum that they could fully replace the IBM
utils for V7, there has been little traffic as of
late. Has it been smooth sailing for everyone?
Looking at our list of open problems with our utility
provider that must be fixed before we can upgrade
makes me wonder.

tim
-



the





the DB2-L webpage at http://listserv.ylassoc.com. The owners of the list
can



the





the DB2-L webpage at http://listserv.ylassoc.com. The owners of the list
can



jwkwan2000

Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?
(in response to Christina S. Maldonado)
Christina,

I don't believe IBM has changed its utility bundling. You can still buy
Operational Utilities or Diagnostic and Recovery Utilities separately. Most
IBM customers prefer Utility Suite since it includes everything. BMC used
to offer to buy IBM utilities if you buy their utilities since some BMC
utilities call IBM utilities internally. If anyone of you are using BMC
utilities, ask BMC sales rep to include IBM utilities in the package.


Regards,


James Kwan
IBM Certified Solutions Expert
- DB2 V7.1 Database Administration for OS/390

----- Original Message -----
From: "Christina S. Maldonado" <[login to unmask email]>
Newsgroups: bit.listserv.db2-l
To: <[login to unmask email]>
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 2:12 PM
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?


> That is what it looks like also in the announcement letter, but when I
> called IBM to ask, they indicated you must purchase the suite in order to
> get the recovery utilities. Maybe it has changed. If you hear
> different from IBM, let me know, so that I may inquire again.
>
>
> Thanks Christina.
> 480-391-4802
>
>
>
>
>
> Tina Hilton
> <[login to unmask email] To:
[login to unmask email]
> YSTEMS.COM> cc:
> Sent by: DB2 Data Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390
v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using
> Base Discussion List IBM utils?
> <[login to unmask email]
> SOC.COM>
>
>
> 01/03/2003 11:29 AM
> Please respond to
> DB2 Data Base
> Discussion List
>
>
>
>
>
>
> You can just buy the diagnostic and recovery utilities (feature 5655-e62).
> You don't need the whole shebang. At least that's what I've read. See
> page
> 211 in http://www.redbooks.ibm.com/pubs/pdfs/redbooks/sg246121.pdf.
>
> Tina
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Christina S. Maldonado [mailto:[login to unmask email]
> Sent: January 03, 2003 11:42 AM
> To: [login to unmask email]
> Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?
>
>
> In order to use any the Modify Recovery you must purchase the entire
> Packaged IBM DB2 Utilities suite, which consist of the DB2 Operational
> Utilities and recovery diagnostics utilities. Just as an FYI, during the
> BUILD2 phase of a reorg, the NPIs are locked out for SQL processing.
>
>
>
> Thanks Christina.
> 480-391-4802
>
>
>
>
>
> Tina Hilton
> <[login to unmask email] To:
> [login to unmask email]
> YSTEMS.COM> cc:
> Sent by: DB2 Data Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390
> v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using
> Base Discussion List IBM utils?
> <[login to unmask email]
> SOC.COM>
>
>
> 01/03/2003 05:38 AM
> Please respond to
> DB2 Data Base
> Discussion List
>
>
>
>
>
>
> I believe there is one IBM utility that no other vendor can fully replace,
> and that's modify recovery. As I recall, they can delete the records from
> syscopy but not from syslgrnx, and the DBD doesn't get cleaned up. So if
> you're willing to let your syslgrnx get bigger and bigger and bigger, then
> maybe you can skip the IBM utilities if you already have the CA ones. I
> think BMC C+/Modify would fail the first time it tried to call IBM's
modify
> recovery to do the syslgrnx/DBD cleanup.
>
> We plan to upgrade to V7 this year, with only the utility package that
> include modify recovery. We have BMC products and want to retain the
> ability to do normal modify recovers.
>
> Tina
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Isaac Yassin [mailto:[login to unmask email]
> Sent: January 03, 2003 6:02 AM
> To: [login to unmask email]
> Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?
>
>
> Hi,
>
> Last IDUG (at Lisbon) I talked with both BMC & CA people about it.
>
> BMC people said you must have IBM's utilities if you want to use BMC
> utilities. CA people said you can use only theirs and you don't need
> IBM's utilities to run CA utilities.
>
> I don't have it in writing, it was only during conversations.
>
> Isaac Yassin
> DBMS & IT Consultant
> IBM Certified Solution Expert
> DB2 V7.1 Database Administration for OS/390
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: DB2 Data Base Discussion List [mailto:[login to unmask email]
> On Behalf Of tim malamphy
> Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 2:14 AM
> To: [login to unmask email]
> Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?
>
>
> Has anyone gone production on version 7 WITHOUT
> licensing the IBM utils? If so, are you using CA or
> BMC?
>
> While there was considerable input to the list from
> BMC and Platinum that they could fully replace the IBM
> utils for V7, there has been little traffic as of
> late. Has it been smooth sailing for everyone?
> Looking at our list of open problems with our utility
> provider that must be fixed before we can upgrade
> makes me wonder.
>
> tim
> -
>
>
>
> the
> DB2-L webpage at http://listserv.ylassoc.com. The owners of the list can
be
>
>
>
>
> the DB2-L webpage at http://listserv.ylassoc.com. The owners of the list
> can
>
>
>
> the
> DB2-L webpage at http://listserv.ylassoc.com. The owners of the list can
be
>
>
>
>
> the DB2-L webpage at http://listserv.ylassoc.com. The owners of the list
> can
>
>
>





Cathy Taddei

Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?
(in response to jwkwan2000)
Thanks for the info about CA Merge/Modify, I have verified it with the
vendor. We were leaning towards going without the IBM tools, but without
competition for Modify, I'm not sure any more. Hey, if there's no
competition for Modify, IBM should supply it gratis, right?!? :D

Regards,
Cathy Taddei

-----Original Message-----
From: Tina Hilton [mailto:[login to unmask email]
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 4:39 AM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?


I believe there is one IBM utility that no other vendor can fully replace,
and that's modify recovery. As I recall, they can delete the records from
syscopy but not from syslgrnx, and the DBD doesn't get cleaned up. So if
you're willing to let your syslgrnx get bigger and bigger and bigger, then
maybe you can skip the IBM utilities if you already have the CA ones. I
think BMC C+/Modify would fail the first time it tried to call IBM's modify
recovery to do the syslgrnx/DBD cleanup.

We plan to upgrade to V7 this year, with only the utility package that
include modify recovery. We have BMC products and want to retain the
ability to do normal modify recovers.

Tina

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=====

Francis C - CNF Leblanc

Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?
(in response to Cathy Taddei)
Either that or sell it stand-alone.



-----Original Message-----
From: Taddei, Cathy [mailto:[login to unmask email]
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 2:50 PM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?



Thanks for the info about CA Merge/Modify, I have verified it with the
vendor. We were leaning towards going without the IBM tools, but without
competition for Modify, I'm not sure any more. Hey, if there's no
competition for Modify, IBM should supply it gratis, right?!? :D

Regards,
Cathy Taddei

-----Original Message-----
From: Tina Hilton [mailto:[login to unmask email]
<mailto:[login to unmask email]> ]
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 4:39 AM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?



I believe there is one IBM utility that no other vendor can fully replace,
and that's modify recovery. As I recall, they can delete the records from
syscopy but not from syslgrnx, and the DBD doesn't get cleaned up. So if
you're willing to let your syslgrnx get bigger and bigger and bigger, then
maybe you can skip the IBM utilities if you already have the CA ones. I
think BMC C+/Modify would fail the first time it tried to call IBM's modify
recovery to do the syslgrnx/DBD cleanup.

We plan to upgrade to V7 this year, with only the utility package that
include modify recovery. We have BMC products and want to retain the
ability to do normal modify recovers.

Tina

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--

This email is confidential and may be legally privileged.

It is intended solely for the addressee. Access to this email by anyone
else, unless expressly approved by the sender or an authorized addressee, is
unauthorized.

If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution
or any action omitted or taken in reliance on it, is prohibited and may be
unlawful. If you believe that you have received this email in error, please
contact the sender, delete this e-mail and destroy all copies.


===
==


Tina Hilton

Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?
(in response to Francis C - CNF Leblanc)
I agree 100%.

-----Original Message-----
From: Taddei, Cathy [mailto:[login to unmask email]
Sent: January 03, 2003 5:50 PM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?



Thanks for the info about CA Merge/Modify, I have verified it with the
vendor. We were leaning towards going without the IBM tools, but without
competition for Modify, I'm not sure any more. Hey, if there's no
competition for Modify, IBM should supply it gratis, right?!? :D

Regards,
Cathy Taddei

-----Original Message-----
From: Tina Hilton [ mailto:[login to unmask email]
<mailto:[login to unmask email]> ]
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 4:39 AM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?


I believe there is one IBM utility that no other vendor can fully replace,
and that's modify recovery. As I recall, they can delete the records from
syscopy but not from syslgrnx, and the DBD doesn't get cleaned up. So if
you're willing to let your syslgrnx get bigger and bigger and bigger, then
maybe you can skip the IBM utilities if you already have the CA ones. I
think BMC C+/Modify would fail the first time it tried to call IBM's modify
recovery to do the syslgrnx/DBD cleanup.

We plan to upgrade to V7 this year, with only the utility package that
include modify recovery. We have BMC products and want to retain the
ability to do normal modify recovers.

Tina

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--

This email is confidential and may be legally privileged.

It is intended solely for the addressee. Access to this email by anyone
else, unless expressly approved by the sender or an authorized addressee, is
unauthorized.

If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution
or any action omitted or taken in reliance on it, is prohibited and may be
unlawful. If you believe that you have received this email in error, please
contact the sender, delete this e-mail and destroy all copies.


===
==


Cathy Taddei

Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?
(in response to Tina Hilton)
To be fair, I need to mention that CA technical support has stated that they
plan to add SYSLGRNX and DBD cleanup functionality to their Merge/Modify,
but they would not give me an ETA. They also gave me a few hints to get
along without IBM Modify (one was to double the size of SYSLGRNX) until they
add the functionality, but I don't feel this qualifies as competition.
Right now, there is NO COMPETITION for IBM's Modify utility.

CT

-----Original Message-----
From: Taddei, Cathy [mailto:[login to unmask email]
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 2:50 PM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?



Thanks for the info about CA Merge/Modify, I have verified it with the
vendor. We were leaning towards going without the IBM tools, but without
competition for Modify, I'm not sure any more. Hey, if there's no
competition for Modify, IBM should supply it gratis, right?!? :D

Regards,
Cathy Taddei

-----Original Message-----
From: Tina Hilton [ mailto:[login to unmask email]
<mailto:[login to unmask email]> ]
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 4:39 AM
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?


I believe there is one IBM utility that no other vendor can fully replace,
and that's modify recovery. As I recall, they can delete the records from
syscopy but not from syslgrnx, and the DBD doesn't get cleaned up. So if
you're willing to let your syslgrnx get bigger and bigger and bigger, then
maybe you can skip the IBM utilities if you already have the CA ones. I
think BMC C+/Modify would fail the first time it tried to call IBM's modify
recovery to do the syslgrnx/DBD cleanup.

We plan to upgrade to V7 this year, with only the utility package that
include modify recovery. We have BMC products and want to retain the
ability to do normal modify recovers.

Tina


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This email is confidential and may be legally privileged.

It is intended solely for the addressee. Access to this email by anyone else, unless expressly approved by the sender or an authorized addressee, is unauthorized.

If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution or any action omitted or taken in reliance on it, is prohibited and may be unlawful. If you believe that you have received this email in error, please contact the sender, delete this e-mail and destroy all copies.


=====

Phil Grainger

Re: DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?
(in response to Cathy Taddei)
Just to add some thoughts to this discussion

Firstly Cathy is right - we are actively looking at ways of cleaning out
SYSLGRNGX, as it seems that IBMs initial comments in the Version 7
Announcement letter, which was:

"Utility Support for your DB2 Catalog Data<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns =
"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

DB2 UDB for OS/390 and z/OS, Version 7 delivers the DB2 Utilities Suite in
support of your catalog data. DB2 catalog data is critical for all database
reference and application design. In order to sustain the high-availability
of DB2 for OS/390, this product is delivered with each shipment of DB2 UDB
for OS/390 and z/OS, Version 7. Use these powerful management utilities for
all of your DB2 catalog data management tasks."

doesn't currently seem to apply to the MODIFY RECOVERY utility. Obviously
this is something we hadn't originally planned on doing (based on the above
statement) but it looks like we have to.

Secondly, I'd be interested (off list of course) to hear from anyone who has
pressed IBM about what exactly the announcement letter statement actually
means


Phil Grainger
Computer Associates
Product Manager, DB2
Tel: +44 (0)161 928 9334
Fax: +44 (0)161 941 3775
Mobile: +44 (0)7970 125 752
[login to unmask email]

-----Original Message-----
From: Taddei, Cathy [mailto:[login to unmask email]
Sent: 06 January 2003 17:59
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: [DB2-L] DB2 OS/390 v7 upgrade- Anyone NOT using IBM utils?


To be fair, I need to mention that CA technical support has stated that they
plan to add SYSLGRNX and DBD cleanup functionality to their Merge/Modify,
but they would not give me an ETA. They also gave me a few hints to get
along without IBM Modify (one was to double the size of SYSLGRNX) until they
add the functionality, but I don't feel this qualifies as competition.
Right now, there is NO COMPETITION for IBM's Modify utility.