DB2 Shops on V10

Bob Markway

DB2 Shops on V10
We are currently on V8 z/OS. Originally our plans were to go to V9 in 3rd quarter of 2011, but an IBM rep suggested to management that we should just go directly from V8 to V10. The other DB2 sysprogs and myself (and several DBA's as well) would prefer to go to V9 first. Anyway to make a long story even longer, my concern is it was GA all of two months ago, and after going early on V8 and battling many issues I am in a word, scared (if not scarred) of being on the bleeding edge. Does anyone know of a web site that tracks the percentages of DB2 customers that have gone to V10? Is anyone on V10? If so were there major issues (especally migrating from V8)? Any advantages/disadvantages that you would like to share. I was able to find very little information on V10 migration at all on the web.

Thanks,

Bob

_____________________________________________________________________
* IDUG North America * Anaheim, California * May 2-6 2011 * http://IDUG.ORG/NA *
* If you are going to attend only one conference this year, this is it! *
_____________________________________________________________________
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Edward Long

Re: DB2 Shops on V10
(in response to Bob Markway)
The following is strictly my opinion and does not reflect the view of any other person, place or thing.
It took over a year for V8 and V9 to stabilize to the point where the code matched the hype. Therefore, unless you have a pressing need for something in V9 or V10 your decision comes down to either waiting a year for V10 to stabilize or installing V9 now and planning on V10 in 2012.
If you need something in V10 bad then its worth being the first Indian over the hill. Otherwise, let someone else enjoy the barrage of APARS and go with V9.


Edward Long

--- On Mon, 12/20/10, Bob Markway <[login to unmask email]> wrote:

From: Bob Markway <[login to unmask email]>
Subject: [DB2-L] DB2 Shops on V10
To: [login to unmask email]
Date: Monday, December 20, 2010, 3:55 PM

We are currently on V8 z/OS. Originally our plans were to go to V9 in 3rd quarter of 2011, but an IBM rep suggested to  management that we should just go directly from V8 to V10.  The other DB2 sysprogs and myself (and several DBA's as well) would prefer to go to V9 first.  Anyway to make a long story even longer, my concern is it was GA all of two months ago, and after going early on V8 and battling many issues I am in a word, scared (if not scarred) of being on the bleeding edge.  Does anyone know of a web site that tracks the percentages of DB2 customers that have gone to V10?  Is anyone on V10? If so were there major issues (especally migrating from V8)? Any advantages/disadvantages that you would like to share.  I was able to find very little information on V10 migration at all on the web.

Thanks,

Bob

_____________________________________________________________________
* IDUG North America * Anaheim, California * May 2-6 2011 *  http://IDUG.ORG/NA *
*   If you are going to attend only one conference this year, this is it!   *
_____________________________________________________________________
http://www.IDUG.org/mentor
How can you expand your staff or do succession planning in this economy?
Mentoring is a proven, economical, way to train the next generation of DB2 Users!
_____________________________________________________________________

If you need to change settings, http://www.idug.org/cgi-bin/wa?A0=DB2-L is the home of IDUG's Listserv

_____________________________________________________________________
* IDUG North America * Anaheim, California * May 2-6 2011 * http://IDUG.ORG/NA *
* If you are going to attend only one conference this year, this is it! *
_____________________________________________________________________
http://www.IDUG.org/mentor
How can you expand your staff or do succession planning in this economy?
Mentoring is a proven, economical, way to train the next generation of DB2 Users!
_____________________________________________________________________

If you need to change settings, http://www.idug.org/cgi-bin/wa?A0=DB2-L is the home of IDUG's Listserv

Phil Grainger

Re: DB2 Shops on V10
(in response to Edward Long)
Well, it depends what Bob means by "go to V9 in 3rd quarter of 2011"

If that means STARTING the migration of subsystems o DB2 9 in Q3 2011, then changing that plan to a migration to DB2 10 in Q3 2011, then I wouldn't be anywhere near so concerned as starting a DB2 V8 to 10 migration NOW - and it fits in with Eds "after a year" suggestion too
Phil Grainger
Cogito Ltd.
[login to unmask email]
+44 (0) 1298 872 148
+44 (0) 7505 266 768
www.cogito.co.uk <blocked:: http://www.cogito.co.uk >

Attend IDUG 2011 - the premiere events for DB2 professionals.
IDUG North America < http://www.idug.org/na > , 2-6 May, Anaheim California
IDUG EMEA < http://www.idug.org/emea > , 14-18 November, Prague Czech Republic


From: IDUG DB2-L [mailto:[login to unmask email] On Behalf Of Ed Long
Sent: 20 December 2010 21:54
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: [DB2-L] DB2 Shops on V10

The following is strictly my opinion and does not reflect the view of any other person, place or thing.
It took over a year for V8 and V9 to stabilize to the point where the code matched the hype. Therefore, unless you have a pressing need for something in V9 or V10 your decision comes down to either waiting a year for V10 to stabilize or installing V9 now and planning on V10 in 2012.
If you need something in V10 bad then its worth being the first Indian over the hill. Otherwise, let someone else enjoy the barrage of APARS and go with V9.


Edward Long

--- On Mon, 12/20/10, Bob Markway <[login to unmask email]> wrote:

From: Bob Markway <[login to unmask email]>
Subject: [DB2-L] DB2 Shops on V10
To: [login to unmask email]
Date: Monday, December 20, 2010, 3:55 PM
We are currently on V8 z/OS. Originally our plans were to go to V9 in 3rd quarter of 2011, but an IBM rep suggested to management that we should just go directly from V8 to V10. The other DB2 sysprogs and myself (and several DBA's as well) would prefer to go to V9 first. Anyway to make a long story even longer, my concern is it was GA all of two months ago, and after going early on V8 and battling many issues I am in a word, scared (if not scarred) of being on the bleeding edge. Does anyone know of a web site that tracks the percentages of DB2 customers that have gone to V10? Is anyone on V10? If so were there major issues (especally migrating from V8)? Any advantages/disadvantages that you would like to share. I was able to find very little information on V10 migration at all on the web.

Thanks,

Bob

_____________________________________________________________________
* IDUG North America * Anaheim, California * May 2-6 2011 * http://IDUG.ORG/NA *
* If you are going to attend only one conference this year, this is it! *
_____________________________________________________________________
http://www.IDUG.org/mentor
How can you expand your staff or do succession planning in this economy?
Mentoring is a proven, economical, way to train the next generation of DB2 Users!
_____________________________________________________________________

If you need to change settings, http://www.idug.org/cgi-bin/wa?A0=DB2-L is the home of IDUG's Listserv


________________________________
>>> Error in line 8 of site.mailtpl: incorrect operand type, leftover data: " = 3" <<< -> .BB &DAYSEQ(3) = 2 or &DAYSEQ(3) = 3 <-

_____________________________________________________________________
* IDUG North America * Anaheim, California * May 2-6 2011 * http://IDUG.ORG/NA *
* Your only source for independent, unbiased, and trusted DB2 information. *
_____________________________________________________________________
http://www.IDUG.org/mentor
Mentoring should be a rewarding experience for everyone...
IDUG is offering up to 80% off when you both come to the conference!
_____________________________________________________________________

If you need to change settings, http://www.idug.org/cgi-bin/wa?A0=DB2-L is the home of IDUG's Listserv

Max Scarpa

Re: DB2 Shops on V10
(in response to Phil Grainger)
Hi all

Until now, from news and papers I read, you can do the big jump but I
don't know if any beta testers jumped from V8 to DB2 10.I think many
migrated from V9. Considering no one migrated a real production system
(for instance V8 beta program had an italian tester and they used a
dedicated subsystem, probably a clone of a prod). For sure IBM provided
this picture (Miller, IDUG 2010):

10% responded moving to DB2 10 as soon as possible
46% responded DB2 9 > DB2 10 when convenient
22% responded DB2 V8 > DB2 9
19% responded DB2 V8 > DB2 10

So it seems only 20% planned to move to DB2 10 with one jump but they
don't say when (ie if after GA or after DB2 10 is 'mature').

IBM statistics show a decrease in issues when migrating from one version
to another, but it's only a quality control not a technical safe. In my
opinion it strongly depends on how good is your testing. For example:
- usually main applications are checked and tested (I mean programs) with
online transaction (many) and/or batch jobs (few) but there's no real
'load test' to check what happen under heavy workload. You realize there's
a problem late in your life. In Db2 10 I'd consider to test this kind of
workload.
- Considering DB2 10 main goal is performance improvements I'd look
carefully to pre requisites, and expecially for z/OS . See apar II14474,
where it seems some PTFs are relate to storage management for example.
Here I'd expect some issues (I was burned by a z/OS PTF when dealing with
LOBs in V7).
- Considering DB2 isn't a lone star, I'd check carefully if vendors are
ready (and they are always ready, isn't it ? ;-)) and if I'm using any 3rd
party product to manage critical prod processes I'd check that part of
prod with attention (monitors - which are pervasive - first).
- Check what isn't allowed in DB2 10: the impact will be higher with
respect a V9 - DB2 10 migration and you could have some unpleasant
surprises. For example it's time to stop simple tablespace definition,
remove old precompiler, SMS is mandatory, and more to check before jump.
- 'Errare humanum est but to create real messes you need data sharing'.
Simply to say in data sharing environments, where you have many things to
consider, you've to pay even more attention starting from CF levels and
structures.

For a good view about migrations activities see:

DB2 10 for z/OS Migration Planning by
Roger Miller IDUG 2010

Questions and Answers about DB2 10 for z/OS

Just some thoughts from what I read and IDUG 2010 discussions.

Max Scarpa
Certified.......???


> We are currently on V8 z/OS. Originally our plans were to go to V9
> in 3rd quarter of 2011, but an IBM rep suggested to management that
> we should just go directly from V8 to V10. The other DB2 sysprogs
> and myself (and several DBA's as well) would prefer to go to V9
> first. Anyway to make a long story even longer, my concern is it
> was GA all of two months ago, and after going early on V8 and
> battling many issues I am in a word, scared (if not scarred) of
> being on the bleeding edge. Does anyone know of a web site that
> tracks the percentages of DB2 customers that have gone to V10? Is
> anyone on V10? If so were there major issues (especally migrating
> from V8)? Any advantages/disadvantages that you would like to share.
> I was able to find very little information on V10 migration at all on
the web.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bob
>
> _____________________________________________________________________
> * IDUG North America * Anaheim, California * May 2-6 2011 * http://
> IDUG.ORG/NA *
> * If you are going to attend only one conference this year, this is
it! *
> _____________________________________________________________________
> http://www.IDUG.org/mentor
> How can you expand your staff or do succession planning in this economy?
> Mentoring is a proven, economical, way to train the next generation
> of DB2 Users!
> _____________________________________________________________________
>
> If you need to change settings, http://www.idug.org/cgi-bin/wa?A0=DB2-L
> is the home of IDUG's Listserv

_____________________________________________________________________
* IDUG North America * Anaheim, California * May 2-6 2011 * http://IDUG.ORG/NA *
* Your only source for independent, unbiased, and trusted DB2 information. *
_____________________________________________________________________
http://www.IDUG.org/mentor
Mentoring should be a rewarding experience for everyone...
IDUG is offering up to 80% off when you both come to the conference!
_____________________________________________________________________

If you need to change settings, http://www.idug.org/cgi-bin/wa?A0=DB2-L is the home of IDUG's Listserv

Cuneyt Goksu

Re: DB2 Shops on V10
(in response to Max Scarpa)
I would like to give my 2 cents too...

In my region, most of the customers are either running V9 or already in the
middle of V9 Migration project. There is just one client just migrated to V8
from V7 few months ago. We're planning to move them to V10 in 2011Q4. There
are 2 main drivers for this. One is out-of-box savings and the second is
they can not afford to initiate two migration projects in 3-4 years
consecutively. They're outsourcing the migration projects and they're
staying behind the versions. If They move to V10 next year, They will not
need to consider Migration at least 4 years...

Regards, Cuneyt

--
> We are currently on V8 z/OS. Originally our plans were to go to V9
> in 3rd quarter of 2011, but an IBM rep suggested to management that
> we should just go directly from V8 to V10. The other DB2 sysprogs
> and myself (and several DBA's as well) would prefer to go to V9
> first. Anyway to make a long story even longer, my concern is it
> was GA all of two months ago, and after going early on V8 and
> battling many issues I am in a word, scared (if not scarred) of
> being on the bleeding edge. Does anyone know of a web site that
> tracks the percentages of DB2 customers that have gone to V10? Is
> anyone on V10? If so were there major issues (especally migrating
> from V8)? Any advantages/disadvantages that you would like to share.
> I was able to find very little information on V10 migration at all on the
web.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bob
>
> _____________________________________________________________________

_____________________________________________________________________
* IDUG North America * Anaheim, California * May 2-6 2011 * http://IDUG.ORG/NA *
* Your only source for independent, unbiased, and trusted DB2 information. *
_____________________________________________________________________
http://www.IDUG.org/mentor
Mentoring should be a rewarding experience for everyone...
IDUG is offering up to 80% off when you both come to the conference!
_____________________________________________________________________

If you need to change settings, http://www.idug.org/cgi-bin/wa?A0=DB2-L is the home of IDUG's Listserv

Chris Hoelscher

Re: DB2 Shops on V10
(in response to Cuneyt Goksu)
interesting - our IBM rep told is it is indeed possible to go from 8 to 10
(we are on 8) but that he did NOT recommend it (we just got 9 in house in
October)

Chris Hoelscher
IDMS/DB2 System & Database Architect
Humana Inc
502-476-2538
[login to unmask email]

I refuse to repeat gossip - so listen carefully the first time




The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain CONFIDENTIAL material. If you receive this material/information in error, please contact the sender and delete or destroy the material/information.

_____________________________________________________________________
* IDUG North America * Anaheim, California * May 2-6 2011 * http://IDUG.ORG/NA *
* Your only source for independent, unbiased, and trusted DB2 information. *
_____________________________________________________________________
http://www.IDUG.org/mentor
Mentoring should be a rewarding experience for everyone...
IDUG is offering up to 80% off when you both come to the conference!
_____________________________________________________________________

If you need to change settings, http://www.idug.org/cgi-bin/wa?A0=DB2-L is the home of IDUG's Listserv

Myron Miller

Re: DB2 Shops on V10
(in response to Chris Hoelscher)
Personally, I'll freely admit I'm torn and highly prejudiced here. If you rely
on OSC or Visual Explain heavily, then I'd recommend staying with the plan of
going to Db2 V9 and avoid DB2 10 as long as possible. Data Studio query tuning
is nowhere as functional, nor works anywhere near as well as OSC, not including
the fact that it's got a number of bugs.

If this is not important to you, then personally (and here's where my prejudice
definitely shows), I'd avoid DB2 V9 like the plaque and go directly to DB2 V10.
V9 has had lots and lots of issues and for some people has caused a noticeable
and serious degradation in performance (up to 40% and more has been documented )

Now, that does not mean that you should not carefully and I do mean extremely
carefully plan and test the conversion. There are lots of changes that can and
will impact your conversion. And that includes considering the impact and using
much much more extensive and comprehensive runstats than most shops use/(d) in
V8. But V10 has lots and lots of extra benefits and going to it will avoid some
of the issues with V9 that many of us suffer(ed) thru. Personally, other than I
rely on OSC extensively and hate using DS because of its problems, I'm really
looking forward to going to V10 soon at my client's site and getting out of DB2
V9.

I'd also strongly consider using Plan Stability (lousy name, I agree) as soon as
possible. It'll be worth it in the migration, especially if you do decide to go
to V9. Maintenance in V9 can and has caused access path degradations, in some
cases the new access path via explain looked better but performed worse. So be
careful even after you go there, if you do.

Myron



________________________________
From: Max Scarpa <[login to unmask email]>
To: [login to unmask email]
Sent: Tue, December 21, 2010 4:42:54 AM
Subject: Re: [DB2-L] DB2 Shops on V10

Hi all

Until now, from news and papers I read, you can do the big jump but I don't know
if any beta testers jumped from V8 to DB2 10.I think many migrated from V9.
Considering no one migrated a real production system (for instance V8 beta
program had an italian tester and they used a dedicated subsystem, probably a
clone of a prod). For sure IBM provided this picture (Miller, IDUG 2010):


10% responded moving to DB2 10 as soon as possible
46% responded DB2 9 > DB2 10 when convenient
22% responded DB2 V8 > DB2 9
19% responded DB2 V8 > DB2 10

So it seems only 20% planned to move to DB2 10 with one jump but they don't say
when (ie if after GA or after DB2 10 is 'mature').


IBM statistics show a decrease in issues when migrating from one version to
another, but it's only a quality control not a technical safe. In my opinion it
strongly depends on how good is your testing. For example:

- usually main applications are checked and tested (I mean programs) with
online transaction (many) and/or batch jobs (few) but there's no real 'load
test' to check what happen under heavy workload. You realize there's a problem
late in your life. In Db2 10 I'd consider to test this kind of workload.

- Considering DB2 10 main goal is performance improvements I'd look carefully to
pre requisites, and expecially for z/OS . See apar II14474, where it seems some
PTFs are relate to storage management for example. Here I'd expect some issues
(I was burned by a z/OS PTF when dealing with LOBs in V7).

- Considering DB2 isn't a lone star, I'd check carefully if vendors are ready
(and they are always ready, isn't it ? ;-)) and if I'm using any 3rd party
product to manage critical prod processes I'd check that part of prod with
attention (monitors - which are pervasive - first).

- Check what isn't allowed in DB2 10: the impact will be higher with respect a
V9 - DB2 10 migration and you could have some unpleasant surprises. For example
it's time to stop simple tablespace definition, remove old precompiler, SMS is
mandatory, and more to check before jump.

- 'Errare humanum est but to create real messes you need data sharing'. Simply
to say in data sharing environments, where you have many things to consider,
you've to pay even more attention starting from CF levels and structures.


For a good view about migrations activities see:

DB2 10 for z/OS Migration Planning by Roger
Miller IDUG 2010


Questions and Answers about DB2 10 for z/OS

Just some thoughts from what I read and IDUG 2010 discussions.

Max Scarpa
Certified.......???


> We are currently on V8 z/OS. Originally our plans were to go to V9
> in 3rd quarter of 2011, but an IBM rep suggested to management that
> we should just go directly from V8 to V10. The other DB2 sysprogs
> and myself (and several DBA's as well) would prefer to go to V9
> first. Anyway to make a long story even longer, my concern is it
> was GA all of two months ago, and after going early on V8 and
> battling many issues I am in a word, scared (if not scarred) of
> being on the bleeding edge. Does anyone know of a web site that
> tracks the percentages of DB2 customers that have gone to V10? Is
> anyone on V10? If so were there major issues (especally migrating
> from V8)? Any advantages/disadvantages that you would like to share.
> I was able to find very little information on V10 migration at all on the web.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bob
>
> _____________________________________________________________________
> * IDUG North America * Anaheim, California * May 2-6 2011 * http://
> IDUG.ORG/NA *
> * If you are going to attend only one conference this year, this is it! *
> _____________________________________________________________________
> http://www.IDUG.org/mentor
> How can you expand your staff or do succession planning in this economy?
> Mentoring is a proven, economical, way to train the next generation
> of DB2 Users!
> _____________________________________________________________________
>
> If you need to change settings, http://www.idug.org/cgi-bin/wa?A0=DB2-L
> is the home of IDUG's Listserv

________________________________
>>> Error in line 8 of site.mailtpl: incorrect operand type, leftover data: " =
3" <<< -> .BB &DAYSEQ(3) = 2 or &DAYSEQ(3) = 3 <-

_____________________________________________________________________
* IDUG North America * Anaheim, California * May 2-6 2011 * http://IDUG.ORG/NA *
* Your only source for independent, unbiased, and trusted DB2 information. *
_____________________________________________________________________
http://www.IDUG.org/mentor
Mentoring should be a rewarding experience for everyone...
IDUG is offering up to 80% off when you both come to the conference!
_____________________________________________________________________

If you need to change settings, http://www.idug.org/cgi-bin/wa?A0=DB2-L is the home of IDUG's Listserv

Scott Goodell

Re: DB2 Shops on V10
(in response to Myron Miller)
We participated in the BETA for DB2 10 and did migrate from V8 to DB2 10 without any issues on a standalone test subsystem and a data sharing group with two members, so it is possible. At this time we are on V8 on all subsystem and plan to start migration to DB2 10 later in 2011.

_____________________________________________________________________
* IDUG EMEA * Prague, Czech Republic * 14-18 November 2011 * http://IDUG.ORG/EMEA *
* If you are going to attend only one conference this year, this is it! *
** The most DB2 technical sessions of any conference
** Access IBM experts and developers
_____________________________________________________________________

If you need to change settings, http://www.idug.org/cgi-bin/wa?A0=DB2-L is the home of IDUG's Listserv

Phil Grainger

Re: DB2 Shops on V10
(in response to Scott Goodell)
“….Plan Stability (lousy name, I agree)” – doesn’t “Access Path Stability” sound MUCH better?

I keep subliminally trying to change it’s name, but it hasn’t caught on yet

Still Happy Christmas/Happy Holidays to one and all
Phil Grainger
Cogito Ltd.
[login to unmask email]
+44 (0) 1298 872 148
+44 (0) 7505 266 768
www.cogito.co.uk <blocked:: http://www.cogito.co.uk >

Attend IDUG 2011 - the premiere events for DB2 professionals.
IDUG North America < http://www.idug.org/na > , 2-6 May, Anaheim California
IDUG EMEA < http://www.idug.org/emea > , 14-18 November, Prague Czech Republic


From: IDUG DB2-L [mailto:[login to unmask email] On Behalf Of Myron Miller
Sent: 21 December 2010 19:35
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: [DB2-L] DB2 Shops on V10

Personally, I'll freely admit I'm torn and highly prejudiced here. If you rely on OSC or Visual Explain heavily, then I'd recommend staying with the plan of going to Db2 V9 and avoid DB2 10 as long as possible. Data Studio query tuning is nowhere as functional, nor works anywhere near as well as OSC, not including the fact that it's got a number of bugs.

If this is not important to you, then personally (and here's where my prejudice definitely shows), I'd avoid DB2 V9 like the plaque and go directly to DB2 V10. V9 has had lots and lots of issues and for some people has caused a noticeable and serious degradation in performance (up to 40% and more has been documented )

Now, that does not mean that you should not carefully and I do mean extremely carefully plan and test the conversion. There are lots of changes that can and will impact your conversion. And that includes considering the impact and using much much more extensive and comprehensive runstats than most shops use/(d) in V8. But V10 has lots and lots of extra benefits and going to it will avoid some of the issues with V9 that many of us suffer(ed) thru. Personally, other than I rely on OSC extensively and hate using DS because of its problems, I'm really looking forward to going to V10 soon at my client's site and getting out of DB2 V9.

I'd also strongly consider using Plan Stability (lousy name, I agree) as soon as possible. It'll be worth it in the migration, especially if you do decide to go to V9. Maintenance in V9 can and has caused access path degradations, in some cases the new access path via explain looked better but performed worse. So be careful even after you go there, if you do.

Myron

________________________________
From: Max Scarpa <[login to unmask email]>
To: [login to unmask email]
Sent: Tue, December 21, 2010 4:42:54 AM
Subject: Re: [DB2-L] DB2 Shops on V10

Hi all

Until now, from news and papers I read, you can do the big jump but I don't know if any beta testers jumped from V8 to DB2 10.I think many migrated from V9. Considering no one migrated a real production system (for instance V8 beta program had an italian tester and they used a dedicated subsystem, probably a clone of a prod). For sure IBM provided this picture (Miller, IDUG 2010):

10% responded moving to DB2 10 as soon as possible
46% responded DB2 9 > DB2 10 when convenient
22% responded DB2 V8 > DB2 9
19% responded DB2 V8 > DB2 10

So it seems only 20% planned to move to DB2 10 with one jump but they don't say when (ie if after GA or after DB2 10 is 'mature').

IBM statistics show a decrease in issues when migrating from one version to another, but it's only a quality control not a technical safe. In my opinion it strongly depends on how good is your testing. For example:
- usually main applications are checked and tested (I mean programs) with online transaction (many) and/or batch jobs (few) but there's no real 'load test' to check what happen under heavy workload. You realize there's a problem late in your life. In Db2 10 I'd consider to test this kind of workload.
- Considering DB2 10 main goal is performance improvements I'd look carefully to pre requisites, and expecially for z/OS . See apar II14474, where it seems some PTFs are relate to storage management for example. Here I'd expect some issues (I was burned by a z/OS PTF when dealing with LOBs in V7).
- Considering DB2 isn't a lone star, I'd check carefully if vendors are ready (and they are always ready, isn't it ? ;-)) and if I'm using any 3rd party product to manage critical prod processes I'd check that part of prod with attention (monitors - which are pervasive - first).
- Check what isn't allowed in DB2 10: the impact will be higher with respect a V9 - DB2 10 migration and you could have some unpleasant surprises. For example it's time to stop simple tablespace definition, remove old precompiler, SMS is mandatory, and more to check before jump.
- 'Errare humanum est but to create real messes you need data sharing'. Simply to say in data sharing environments, where you have many things to consider, you've to pay even more attention starting from CF levels and structures.

For a good view about migrations activities see:

DB2 10 for z/OS Migration Planning by Roger Miller IDUG 2010

Questions and Answers about DB2 10 for z/OS

Just some thoughts from what I read and IDUG 2010 discussions.

Max Scarpa
Certified.......???


> We are currently on V8 z/OS. Originally our plans were to go to V9
> in 3rd quarter of 2011, but an IBM rep suggested to management that
> we should just go directly from V8 to V10. The other DB2 sysprogs
> and myself (and several DBA's as well) would prefer to go to V9
> first. Anyway to make a long story even longer, my concern is it
> was GA all of two months ago, and after going early on V8 and
> battling many issues I am in a word, scared (if not scarred) of
> being on the bleeding edge. Does anyone know of a web site that
> tracks the percentages of DB2 customers that have gone to V10? Is
> anyone on V10? If so were there major issues (especally migrating
> from V8)? Any advantages/disadvantages that you would like to share.
> I was able to find very little information on V10 migration at all on the web.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bob
>
> _____________________________________________________________________
> * IDUG North America * Anaheim, California * May 2-6 2011 * http://
> IDUG.ORG/NA < http://IDUG.ORG/NA > *
> * If you are going to attend only one conference this year, this is it! *
> _____________________________________________________________________
> http://www.IDUG.org/mentor < http://www.idug.org/mentor >
> How can you expand your staff or do succession planning in this economy?
> Mentoring is a proven, economical, way to train the next generation
> of DB2 Users!
> _____________________________________________________________________
>
> If you need to change settings, http://www.idug.org/cgi-bin/wa?A0=DB2-L
> is the home of IDUG's Listserv
________________________________
>>> Error in line 8 of site.mailtpl: incorrect operand type, leftover data: " = 3" <<< -> .BB &DAYSEQ(3) = 2 or &DAYSEQ(3) = 3 <-

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* IDUG EMEA * Prague, Czech Republic * 14-18 November 2011 * http://IDUG.ORG/EMEA *
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** The most DB2 technical sessions of any conference
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Raymond Bell

Re: DB2 Shops on V10
(in response to Phil Grainger)
Gonna start a war if you’re not careful...

Better change it to the PATH_TABLE while we’re at it, eh? Or ACCESS_PATH_TABLE?

I know, as we all do, it’s the access path that’s being stabilised, rather than a reference to the DB2 object we all know and love called the Plan, but IBM unintentionally made a naming rod for their backs when introducing Plans. Packages, eh? Who’d a thought? Probably a bit late to turn that particular super tanker around.

Laters,


Raymond
PS. I agree Phil; it does sound much better. Oh well...

From: IDUG DB2-L [mailto:[login to unmask email] On Behalf Of Phil Grainger
Sent: 22 December 2010 15:37
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: [DB2-L] DB2 Shops on V10

“….Plan Stability (lousy name, I agree)” – doesn’t “Access Path Stability” sound MUCH better?

I keep subliminally trying to change it’s name, but it hasn’t caught on yet

Still Happy Christmas/Happy Holidays to one and all
Phil Grainger
Cogito Ltd.
[login to unmask email]
+44 (0) 1298 872 148
+44 (0) 7505 266 768
www.cogito.co.uk <blocked:: http://www.cogito.co.uk >

Attend IDUG 2011 - the premiere events for DB2 professionals.
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From: IDUG DB2-L [mailto:[login to unmask email] On Behalf Of Myron Miller
Sent: 21 December 2010 19:35
To: [login to unmask email]
Subject: Re: [DB2-L] DB2 Shops on V10

Personally, I'll freely admit I'm torn and highly prejudiced here. If you rely on OSC or Visual Explain heavily, then I'd recommend staying with the plan of going to Db2 V9 and avoid DB2 10 as long as possible. Data Studio query tuning is nowhere as functional, nor works anywhere near as well as OSC, not including the fact that it's got a number of bugs.

If this is not important to you, then personally (and here's where my prejudice definitely shows), I'd avoid DB2 V9 like the plaque and go directly to DB2 V10. V9 has had lots and lots of issues and for some people has caused a noticeable and serious degradation in performance (up to 40% and more has been documented )

Now, that does not mean that you should not carefully and I do mean extremely carefully plan and test the conversion. There are lots of changes that can and will impact your conversion. And that includes considering the impact and using much much more extensive and comprehensive runstats than most shops use/(d) in V8. But V10 has lots and lots of extra benefits and going to it will avoid some of the issues with V9 that many of us suffer(ed) thru. Personally, other than I rely on OSC extensively and hate using DS because of its problems, I'm really looking forward to going to V10 soon at my client's site and getting out of DB2 V9.

I'd also strongly consider using Plan Stability (lousy name, I agree) as soon as possible. It'll be worth it in the migration, especially if you do decide to go to V9. Maintenance in V9 can and has caused access path degradations, in some cases the new access path via explain looked better but performed worse. So be careful even after you go there, if you do.

Myron

________________________________
From: Max Scarpa <[login to unmask email]>
To: [login to unmask email]
Sent: Tue, December 21, 2010 4:42:54 AM
Subject: Re: [DB2-L] DB2 Shops on V10

Hi all

Until now, from news and papers I read, you can do the big jump but I don't know if any beta testers jumped from V8 to DB2 10.I think many migrated from V9. Considering no one migrated a real production system (for instance V8 beta program had an italian tester and they used a dedicated subsystem, probably a clone of a prod). For sure IBM provided this picture (Miller, IDUG 2010):

10% responded moving to DB2 10 as soon as possible
46% responded DB2 9 > DB2 10 when convenient
22% responded DB2 V8 > DB2 9
19% responded DB2 V8 > DB2 10

So it seems only 20% planned to move to DB2 10 with one jump but they don't say when (ie if after GA or after DB2 10 is 'mature').

IBM statistics show a decrease in issues when migrating from one version to another, but it's only a quality control not a technical safe. In my opinion it strongly depends on how good is your testing. For example:
- usually main applications are checked and tested (I mean programs) with online transaction (many) and/or batch jobs (few) but there's no real 'load test' to check what happen under heavy workload. You realize there's a problem late in your life. In Db2 10 I'd consider to test this kind of workload.
- Considering DB2 10 main goal is performance improvements I'd look carefully to pre requisites, and expecially for z/OS . See apar II14474, where it seems some PTFs are relate to storage management for example. Here I'd expect some issues (I was burned by a z/OS PTF when dealing with LOBs in V7).
- Considering DB2 isn't a lone star, I'd check carefully if vendors are ready (and they are always ready, isn't it ? ;-)) and if I'm using any 3rd party product to manage critical prod processes I'd check that part of prod with attention (monitors - which are pervasive - first).
- Check what isn't allowed in DB2 10: the impact will be higher with respect a V9 - DB2 10 migration and you could have some unpleasant surprises. For example it's time to stop simple tablespace definition, remove old precompiler, SMS is mandatory, and more to check before jump.
- 'Errare humanum est but to create real messes you need data sharing'. Simply to say in data sharing environments, where you have many things to consider, you've to pay even more attention starting from CF levels and structures.

For a good view about migrations activities see:

DB2 10 for z/OS Migration Planning by Roger Miller IDUG 2010

Questions and Answers about DB2 10 for z/OS

Just some thoughts from what I read and IDUG 2010 discussions.

Max Scarpa
Certified.......???


> We are currently on V8 z/OS. Originally our plans were to go to V9
> in 3rd quarter of 2011, but an IBM rep suggested to management that
> we should just go directly from V8 to V10. The other DB2 sysprogs
> and myself (and several DBA's as well) would prefer to go to V9
> first. Anyway to make a long story even longer, my concern is it
> was GA all of two months ago, and after going early on V8 and
> battling many issues I am in a word, scared (if not scarred) of
> being on the bleeding edge. Does anyone know of a web site that
> tracks the percentages of DB2 customers that have gone to V10? Is
> anyone on V10? If so were there major issues (especally migrating
> from V8)? Any advantages/disadvantages that you would like to share.
> I was able to find very little information on V10 migration at all on the web.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bob
>
> _____________________________________________________________________
> * IDUG North America * Anaheim, California * May 2-6 2011 * http://
> IDUG.ORG/NA < http://IDUG.ORG/NA > *
> * If you are going to attend only one conference this year, this is it! *
> _____________________________________________________________________
> http://www.IDUG.org/mentor < http://www.idug.org/mentor >
> How can you expand your staff or do succession planning in this economy?
> Mentoring is a proven, economical, way to train the next generation
> of DB2 Users!
> _____________________________________________________________________
>
> If you need to change settings, http://www.idug.org/cgi-bin/wa?A0=DB2-L
> is the home of IDUG's Listserv
________________________________
>>> Error in line 8 of site.mailtpl: incorrect operand type, leftover data: " = 3" <<< -> .BB &DAYSEQ(3) = 2 or &DAYSEQ(3) = 3 <-

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The IDUG DB2-L Listserv is only part of your membership in IDUG. If you are not already an IDUG member, please register here. < http://www.idug.org/register >

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_____________________________________________________________________
* IDUG EMEA * Prague, Czech Republic * 14-18 November 2011 * http://IDUG.ORG/EMEA *
* If you are going to attend only one conference this year, this is it! *
** The most DB2 technical sessions of any conference
** Access IBM experts and developers
_____________________________________________________________________

If you need to change settings, http://www.idug.org/cgi-bin/wa?A0=DB2-L is the home of IDUG's Listserv

Bob Markway

Re: DB2 Shops on V10
(in response to Raymond Bell)
Thanks for your input, as I thought it is a little early for us to jump that far, and will continue to reccomend that we go the traditional route of V8-V9-V10.

One correction that Phil pointed out. We planned on going to V9 3Q of 2011, and I hope that remains the plan.

Thanks,

Bob

_____________________________________________________________________
* IDUG EMEA * Prague, Czech Republic * 14-18 November 2011 * http://IDUG.ORG/EMEA *
* If you are going to attend only one conference this year, this is it! *
** The most DB2 technical sessions of any conference
** Access IBM experts and developers
_____________________________________________________________________

If you need to change settings, http://www.idug.org/cgi-bin/wa?A0=DB2-L is the home of IDUG's Listserv